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Seam Sealer Removal

During the replacement of welded on parts there is a need to replace the seam sealer on that part, but before we can replace the sealer we need to remove the old material. This could be a time consuming and labor intensive operation for some panels. The question we receive at the DEG is “Would the time required to remove and apply the seam sealer be included in the panel replacement time? “. To answer the question we need to look at the P-Page or estimating guide for each estimating system.

CCC

 Located on page G10 o of the Motor Guide to Estimating you will see the following paragraph:

The times reported in this publication are to be used as a GUIDE ONLY. Reported times include normal align procedure to insure proper fit of the individual new part being replaced. Reported times

include tube/paddled OEM caulking and seam sealer removal/application on welded replacement panels. Sprayable seam sealer equipment requires preparation and adjustment before application and is NOT INCLUDED IN LABOR TIME.

 

CCC/Motor’s position is the time for application AND removal is included for seam sealer. This should be taken into consideration during the replacement of a panel and if you feel the time in the estimating system is not sufficient then you can visit the DEG website and submit an inquiry. We will then contact CCC and ask them to review the time.

 

Mitchell

On page 16 of the Mitchell Collision Estimating Guide they have the following paragraph under the Not Included Operations:

 

• Blending into adjacent panel and/or panels, or nearest breaking point

• Color match or tinting

• Applying anti-corrosion rust resistant materials

• Additional application of soft chip primers or anti-chip undercoats

• Finish sand and buff

• Subsequent vehicle bagging when required: add .2 hour for each application

& removal

• Mask interior to prevent overspray damage

• Removal of protective coatings

• Removal of release agent from OEM raw plastic components (example:

non-primed bumper covers) See formula under Raw Substrate Prep

• Feather, Prime & Block paint damage to adjacent panel and/or panels

joined by welding due to burn damage (see Feather, Prime & Block definition

under Refinish General Information)

• Gravel guard refinish; add .5 hour for the first major panel and .3 hour for

each additional panel.

 

The highlighted text above states the removal of protective coatings is not included and this would reference the seam sealer.

 

Audatex

Audatex states that the application of the seam sealer is included for welded parts but the removal of the old sealer is NOT included and can be found on page 54 of the Audatex Database Reference Manual

 

Removal of debris, grease, corrosion, protective coatings, or other materials impeding replacement, R&I, or refinishing of parts.

  

This was confirmed with DEG inquiry number 2951 and can be found on our website www.degweb.org

 

We have reviewed our labor to replace the rear body panel, the labor to apply new the seam sealer is included in our replace time,
the labor to remove the old seam sealer is not included and this would be covered in the reference manual section 4-2 Labor Exclusions,
*Removal of debris, grease, corrosion, protective coatings, or other materials impeding replacement, R&I, or refinishing of parts.
When replacing rear body panels, Audatex refinish labor includes both exterior and interior surfaces (edge time includes the interior surface).
Some of the same processes that apply to exterior parts were occasionally observed in refinish of interior parts, although not with the same care and attention given to exterior panels. Most interior parts requiring refinish are covered with finish panels, carpets, and trim and as such, are not usually seen.
No other changes are warranted at this time.”

 

To summarize the labor to remove the seam sealer is not included with Mitchell and Audatex but in CCC the labor to remove and apply the seam sealer is included. Please visit our website at www.degweb.org.

Comments




  • Reading and understanding the guides is everyones responsiblilty. The insurance companies do not read the guide, they think the guide will fix the vehicle. Educate the insurance adjuster!


    For shops it is more important to understand the guides shortcomings for that will lend itself to better estimating at your shop. It is the shops responsibility to provide a written comprehensive repair path indentifying all of the repair procedures necessary to properly restore the vehicle back from a collision. In doing so before the repairs commence affords the shop proper time to find all the procedures not included (like your comment) and negotiate with the insurance company.


    IF YOU DONT ASK FOR IT THEY WONT PAY YOU !!! 


    Identifyintg the not - included items omitted from the guide will make the difference between a profitable job or breaking even. I recommmend a shop meeting to identify the forgotten operations in most repairs and break it down into individual components. Then create a book or guide for your shop estimators with pictures of each procedure so they can better explain it to the insurance company so you can justify your additional charges and start to be paid for all the items omitted from insurance estimates.


    The insurance companies want you to do a good job because it reduces their liability, they just dont want to pay for it. You may not get paid the first or second time but if you continue to ask and you can prove it you will start to be compensated for the necessary additional charge.


    Seamsealer is one of those things that insurance companies like to menu expense for $10.00 . If you accept their offer they win. I ran a Cadillac store for many years and an Escalade quarter panel took multiple tubes of two part seamsealer and expanding foam to complete properly. We would charge over $200.00 just for the material plus additonal labor and we could prove it , so they paid.


    Dont just ask for it .....prove that it is required .

    crashmaster, 2 years ago | Flag
  • I'm not impressed what any estimating system says. It's time consuming,dirty,and requires specialized tools. Either an inductor or a crud buster. You need to weld or bond to clean metal. The insurance companies need to just pay the tech and move on.


     

    bondojoe, 2 years ago | Flag

Uploaded By: degart
2 years ago
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